Main MessageBoard / Lolli.org Updates /

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MEZZANINE
Member
I think Lolli should nix the 'message board' thing altogether, and just remain as an ad / bulletin board space.

No, wait, hear me out!

By eliminating human interaction:

- No more trolling
- No need to worry about moderation, banning, or social upkeep
- All promotional crews and events would be held on equal ground; well, unless they pay for extra ad space, that is
- Elimination of all negativity
- Elimination of all positivity
- No potential exposure to differing opinion
- Nobody's feelings will be hurt
- Nobody ever has to take responsibility for what they say
- All opinions, discussion, debate, argument, and complete reign of free thought will never be cause for concern again

The utopian internet we all dreamed about could well be within our grasp . . . !
 
Gunther
Member
pretty sure that your wish has been granted.
 
AaronClark
Member
A+

Constructive criticism? We don't allow that here.
 
LOLLI
Moderator

As with all promoters that buy Premium Events and other advertising on lolli, I will protect their investment first.  If I'm asked to remove posts in their thread, I'll remove them.  If I'm asked to lock a thread, I'll lock it.  I've been doing this for years now.  I don't understand why it's such an issue now.

If you don't like what's going on here, feel free to leave.  I don't exactly tell Humanaut how to run their website do I?  So why are you so high and mighty with mine?  It's not like you guys help out me or my website out one bit.  You don't buy advertising.  Hell, you don't even see "lolli.org" on Humanaut flyers.

I'm running a business just like you are.  If you want the wild west internet where anything goes, please setup something on Humanaut and I'll send everyone over to there.  I've tried that model where anything goes and it's never gone anywhere.
 
tst
satan
Member
who got nuked now, lol
 
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  2. Dubstep: helping douchebags get laid since 03
  3. Only hipster trash listen to electro house!
  4. You don't have to dress like a slut to look sexy
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MEZZANINE
Member
Post from LOLLI
As with all promoters that buy Premium Events and other advertising on lolli, I will protect their investment first.  If I'm asked to remove posts in their thread, I'll remove them.  If I'm asked to lock a thread, I'll lock it.  I've been doing this for years now.  I don't understand why it's such an issue now.

If you don't like what's going on here, feel free to leave.  I don't exactly tell Humanaut how to run their website do I?  So why are you so high and mighty with mine?  It's not like you guys help out me or my website out one bit.  You don't buy advertising.  Hell, you don't even see "lolli.org" on Humanaut flyers.

I'm running a business just like you are.  If you want the wild west internet where anything goes, please setup something on Humanaut and I'll send everyone over to there.  I've tried that model where anything goes and it's never gone anywhere.
I would never try to tell you how to run your website, but suggestions appear to be encouraged here.. err..

Since this has always been a 'community' forum to me, shared by many of my friends and acquaintances  for years, I guess am just surprised. I had unfortunately assumed that when people paid for advertisement, they paid for high priority real estate on the website - not protection, bias, and sheep's wool from the moderators. My bad, I guess.

I am not acting high and mighty with your website. I am on here quite a bit. I like your website, and I like you and Sara as friends. I obviously care enough to stick around and talk about this, instead of leave, like so many already have. I support it by using it. That is not enough? I guess we also have to give you free advertising on our promo material in order to avoid resentment?  That is presumptuous and rude. Not only to us, but to the people who work to earn a place on our flyers.

As a long-time user, (and more than handfuls of premium events paid despite your above statements), it is insulting to what I write, what other people write, when I can no longer take confidence in what I read here. For a site that offers event reviews, event discussion, music discussion, people discussion, taking a neighbor's word on how I want to spend my time and money goes a long way. How am I to trust a review if it is all either positive or non-existent? I thought that's why sites like these existed. We can share ideas and thoughts and control our environment in a communal manner.

Since that has all been compromised, and now scorned, I will keep my suggestions to myself next time, use the board to get the word out best I can, and refrain from any engaging or challenging communication.


 
LOLLI
Moderator
Post from MEZZANINEI would never try to tell you how to run your website, but suggestions appear to be encouraged here.. err..

Since this has always been a 'community' forum to me, shared by many of my friends and acquaintances  for years, I guess am just surprised. I had unfortunately assumed that when people paid for advertisement, they paid for high priority real estate on the website - not protection, bias, and sheep's wool from the moderators. My bad, I guess.

I am not acting high and mighty with your website. I am on here quite a bit. I like your website, and I like you and Sara as friends. I obviously care enough to stick around and talk about this, instead of leave, like so many already have. I support it by using it. That is not enough? I guess we also have to give you free advertising on our promo material in order to avoid resentment?  That is presumptuous and rude. Not only to us, but to the people who work to earn a place on our flyers.

As a long-time user, (and more than handfuls of premium events paid despite your above statements), it is insulting to what I write, what other people write, when I can no longer take confidence in what I read here. For a site that offers event reviews, event discussion, music discussion, people discussion, taking a neighbor's word on how I want to spend my time and money goes a long way. How am I to trust a review if it is all either positive or non-existent? I thought that's why sites like these existed. We can share ideas and thoughts and control our environment in a communal manner.

Since that has all been compromised, and now scorned, I will keep my suggestions to myself next time, use the board to get the word out best I can, and refrain from any engaging or challenging communication.


Over the years, there have been many times where I've been asked to delete unfavorable content from Humanaut event threads.  I guess I was protecting you guys as well right?

This site does offer event reviews, discussions, etc.  That's why I was so surprised to see Humanaut blatantly calling out Leone on their own event thread.  Inviting everyone to jump on your bandwagon of protest  hardly seems like an open discussion to me.  I think if your group had a true interest about finding out more information about Leone's group, you would contact them directly and have a real dialog.  Suggesting that I should just shut off all posting seems pretty ridiculous - joking or not.

Sara and I are taking a hardline with not choosing sides in feuds.  We have a site to run, plain and simple.  Just as we accommodate the one promotion group, we'll do the same for the other.  I'm sorry that you don't agree with the decisions we've been making with the site but Sara and I have been working our asses off to transform this website into something better than what is was before.  I understand how you feel but there are many other avenues that you can take to express your opinions.

 
tst
SARA
Moderator
I guess we also have to give you free advertising on our promo material in order to avoid resentment?  That is presumptuous and rude. Not only to us, but to the people who work to earn a place on our flyers.


Free advertising, you mean like the kind of free advertising Lolli.org has been providing all the promoters who post their events on here for years? Or... the free advertising you guys wanted for Via?

We have asked for very little in return from anyone over the years. And contrary to what some may think, no, we don't even make a profit running this site. (Even with all this "advertisement" that we now have running, we're only fortunate enough now to break even.) Regardless, we continue to run this site because it's been an outlet that people have relied on for over a decade. Most people have been kind enough to include our link on their flyers, without us even having to ask. I guess they feel that the work we've done for them over the years has "earned" us a place on their flyers.



 
MEZZANINE
Member
Post from LOLLIOver the years, there have been many times where I've been asked to delete unfavorable content from Humanaut event threads.  I guess I was protecting you guys as well right?

This site does offer event reviews, discussions, etc.  That's why I was so surprised to see Humanaut blatantly calling out Leone on their own event thread.  Inviting everyone to jump on your bandwagon of protest  hardly seems like an open discussion to me.  I think if your group had a true interest about finding out more information about Leone's group, you would contact them directly and have a real dialog.  Suggesting that I should just shut off all posting seems pretty ridiculous - joking or not.

Sara and I are taking a hardline with not choosing sides in feuds.  We have a site to run, plain and simple.  Just as we accommodate the one promotion group, we'll do the same for the other.  I'm sorry that you don't agree with the decisions we've been making with the site but Sara and I have been working our asses off to transform this website into something better than what is was before.  I understand how you feel but there are many other avenues that you can take to express your opinions.

What I have learned from all this is:

Asking a legitimate non-inflammatory question, that affects the success and income of more than just one group of people here, to the people of the party, in a public forum where said groups read and discuss, is:

- "blatant calling out"
- "inviting people to jump on a bandwagon"
- "not an open discussion"
- "not a real dialogue"

If that is the case, then certainly the last two points are a reflection of the site I am posting on. I completely understand and support moderation when it comes to abuse and malcontent, but I never expected us to be lumped into that category, especially given the history and the posters of this site.

I can't recall an instance where we asked to remove content from our threads that was on topic and pertinent to us or the event. It certainly wouldn't have been to avoid a dialogue concerning the intent and nature of what we do. If we did something to deserve getting called out on, it is my opinion that it should stay there, as there would be legitimacy for defense and I have no problem defending it in public, as our model and intentions have always been true.

Leone had a legitimate answer to our inquiry, which was that Pittsburgh could survive with two NYE parties. So what exactly was the problem to begin with? We have no personal beef with them. I believe their actions and behavior here thus far has been uncouth and disrespectful to the natives here, but that was never brought up in their event thread, and simply our opinion from afar.

If house rules are to remove content from threads by the people who paid for a premium event, then those are the rules which I will abide while here. I will remember not to purchase a premium event in the future, so that others will know that what happens in our event threads is uncensored.










 
NCBST2002
Member
Post from Guntherpretty sure that your wish has been granted.
I was gonna say already nailed it.

 
LOLLI
Moderator
Post from MEZZANINEWhat I have learned from all this is:

Asking a legitimate non-inflammatory question, that affects the success and income of more than just one group of people here, to the people of the party, in a public forum where said groups read and discuss, is:

- "blatant calling out"
- "inviting people to jump on a bandwagon"
- "not an open discussion"
- "not a real dialogue"

If that is the case, then certainly the last two points are a reflection of the site I am posting on. I completely understand and support moderation when it comes to abuse and malcontent, but I never expected us to be lumped into that category, especially given the history and the posters of this site.

I can't recall an instance where we asked to remove content from our threads that was on topic and pertinent to us or the event. It certainly wouldn't have been to avoid a dialogue concerning the intent and nature of what we do. If we did something to deserve getting called out on, it is my opinion that it should stay there, as there would be legitimacy for defense and I have no problem defending it in public, as our model and intentions have always been true.

Leone had a legitimate answer to our inquiry, which was that Pittsburgh could survive with two NYE parties. So what exactly was the problem to begin with? We have no personal beef with them. I believe their actions and behavior here thus far has been uncouth and disrespectful to the natives here, but that was never brought up in their event thread, and simply our opinion from afar.

If house rules are to remove content from threads by the people who paid for a premium event, then those are the rules which I will abide while here. I will remember not to purchase a premium event in the future, so that others will know that what happens in our event threads is uncensored.











There are no "house rules" Paul.  We remove content at the request of promoters all the time.  Whether they're premium or non-premium events.  It's mutually beneficial to keep a good working relationship with promoters.

We were asked to delete a total of like six posts.  We didn't have some MO about whose posts they were, they were just removed.  It's weird how this is such a huge deal to you.  It seems that it's more important whose posts were deleted compared to what exactly was posted.

Again, there are other avenues that you can pursue to have your discussion fulfilled.
 
tst
MEZZANINE
Member
Post from LOLLI
There are no "house rules" Paul.  We remove content at the request of promoters all the time.  Whether they're premium or non-premium events.  It's mutually beneficial to keep a good working relationship with promoters.

We were asked to delete a total of like six posts.  We didn't have some MO about whose posts they were, they were just removed.  It's weird how this is such a huge deal to you.  It seems that it's more important whose posts were deleted compared to what exactly was posted.

Again, there are other avenues that you can pursue to have your discussion fulfilled.
Indeed.. content and potential content posted by myself, colleagues, and others which I found to be worthwhile was deleted and I admit, I was bothered by it. But as you pointed out it is ultimately at the OP's discretion as to what we say in the thread, so I guess I should have expected it. Lesson learned - I just won't make future posts. Or at least, try very hard not to!
 
incydeout
Member
I use the message board part of the site more than the events section. It's more personable than Facebook and it's fair game for anyone to join in on a thread which makes conversations that much more enlightening. I'd miss it if it were gone.
 
SheriffKevin
Member

GIRL FIGHT

 
"I love how exceptionally real you keep it."  - Eric Bliss
LOLLI
Moderator
Post from incydeoutI use the message board part of the site more than the events section. It's more personable than Facebook and it's fair game for anyone to join in on a thread which makes conversations that much more enlightening. I'd miss it if it were gone.

I was just talking to my friend yesterday about how Facebook threads have nothing on regular messageboards.  Plus you can post images, videos, etc in regular messageboard replies.
 
tst
satan
Member
Paul when will you learn,



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1FqFfEYT_4
 
  1. Raves, the one place ugly emo's girls go to feel hot,
  2. Dubstep: helping douchebags get laid since 03
  3. Only hipster trash listen to electro house!
  4. You don't have to dress like a slut to look sexy
www.FrankieBonesSucks.org
SARA
Moderator
Post from LOLLI
I was just talking to my friend yesterday about how Facebook threads have nothing on regular messageboards.  Plus you can post images, videos, etc in regular messageboard replies.
I was talking to someone yesterday on Facebook who said that people specifically connected the drama in Pittsburgh with lolli. As in, "Man, from reading on Lolli, Pittsburgh certainly is full of drama."

I was trying to explain that, with or without Lolli, Pittsburgh is STILL full of drama. Lolli just centralized it for a long time. It's funny because with this whole "promoter war" going on, hardly any of it is on this site. It's all on FaceBook. And with Facebook being all over the place, you have to work to keep up with all the drama haha. At least we made it easy. (Only slightly serious.) I do think this site is better sans drama.
 
tika
Moderator
certain things need to be discussed and those things aren't even getting a chance here. I'm a mod and I'm saying it. I'm collecting no profit here, no hit in my pocket, I'm just here to help curb some of the shit, help promote the site, and do the photography end of things. i want to moderate and make this a more well rounded site again. I'm never going to get a chance to moderate anything because theres nothing to moderate.

I'm honestly starting to agree with a lot of people. the boards went from a mess to a nazi regime in 2.5 seconds. that sure as hell isn't making people want to come back if they can't even voice their opinion on something negatively, purely because its negative in someones eyes. criticism should be there to help improve constructively and let others know to be on the lookout for shit. theres a difference between criticism and blatant trolling, but you guys are viewing everything as something bad and that its going to 'hurt business'. the core values of lolli are p much gone now and its just frankie bones staring me down, making sure that i don't say anything wrong.

so not only are people saying that its only drama, they're saying its pointless because you can't talk about anything.

wheres the happy medium? i mean people were bitching about getting ripped off by tall in one of the tall threads and sara put up a yellow light and warned everyone? why? isn't that relevant, topical discussion?

if facebook can't touch the messageboard format, you're wrong because it is and you're letting it.

if you guys are looking at it from a business standpoint then you should probably just stay out of the other end, collect the money and post the advertising. because it seems like from an outside view that you're being paid hush money. I'm trying to stay as neutral as possible. thats my two cents and word on the street.

 
Queen of the Lolli.org Paparazzi // mixes, pics, fun stuff -> kooterkore.com
incydeout
Member
the boards went from a mess to a nazi regime in 2.5 seconds


the core values of lolli are p much gone now and its just frankie bones staring me down, making sure that i don't say anything wrong.


Frankie Bones is a nazi.
 
michaeL25
Member
I agree there should be an open forum, but some people will bash promoters for personal reasons. A new promoter should be able to have a shot at throwing a party. If the party is not delivered, as advertized, then they shouldn't be able to advertize. If you advertize some one's bad goods once, shame on them, if you do it again, your an accomplice. I don't know the situation, but I have worked with some large promoters out west, and have been lucky enough to know some around this area. In the party review section to protect the business aspect of things, parties with good reviews from allot of people(not only, and always the same people) are usually that, good parties'. the parties with few reviews usually sucked. Opening the forum to negativity actually, brings more politics into things, not freedom.          
 
incydeout
Member
^^ It's kind of a grey area to determine which events are bad though.
 
michaeL25
Member
Post from incydeout^^ It's kind of a grey area to determine which events are bad though.
90% of life is a grey area! parties get even more grey areas. If the throwers don't have the acts that they advertise, or in the place they advertise, Not so grey!     I think people should get a fair chance to provide that experience, an if they burn people, black list them till they can provide the experience.    
 
SARA
Moderator
Post from tikacertain things need to be discussed and those things aren't even getting a chance here. I'm a mod and I'm saying it. I'm collecting no profit here, no hit in my pocket, I'm just here to help curb some of the shit, help promote the site, and do the photography end of things. i want to moderate and make this a more well rounded site again. I'm never going to get a chance to moderate anything because theres nothing to moderate.

I'm honestly starting to agree with a lot of people. the boards went from a mess to a nazi regime in 2.5 seconds. that sure as hell isn't making people want to come back if they can't even voice their opinion on something negatively, purely because its negative in someones eyes. criticism should be there to help improve constructively and let others know to be on the lookout for shit. theres a difference between criticism and blatant trolling, but you guys are viewing everything as something bad and that its going to 'hurt business'. the core values of lolli are p much gone now and its just frankie bones staring me down, making sure that i don't say anything wrong.

so not only are people saying that its only drama, they're saying its pointless because you can't talk about anything.

wheres the happy medium? i mean people were bitching about getting ripped off by tall in one of the tall threads and sara put up a yellow light and warned everyone? why? isn't that relevant, topical discussion?

if facebook can't touch the messageboard format, you're wrong because it is and you're letting it.

if you guys are looking at it from a business standpoint then you should probably just stay out of the other end, collect the money and post the advertising. because it seems like from an outside view that you're being paid hush money. I'm trying to stay as neutral as possible. thats my two cents and word on the street.

I have had personal conversations over the past week with people who have raised their concerns to me. After we've sat down and discussed things, for the most part, people understand what we really are and are not doing. So much so that I almost don't have the energy to type up this answer yet again.

I want to make it clear to everyone that we are not taking "hush money". The advertising that you see, and will continue to see, is making it possible for us to finally run the site and not be in the hole. We now have enough money to pay for the server that Rich bought to run the site on it's own. We still don't even make enough money, even with present advertising running, to cover the recent marketing endeavors we have started... emails... flyers... the business cards we're purchasing for the photographers... the various photographic equipment we just bought. That is all coming out of pocket. My only hope is that now that we have started this advertising that maybe... just maybe... we could see some sort of profit so that we CAN grow the website to what we want it to be.

Since we have launched the new website, Rich and I total have deleted maybe 20 posts. That includes the ones in the Leone thread by the Humanauts, and various random posts that included drug talk. The yellow light that I posted in the Tall thread didn't even have to do with Tall. It was turning into personal bashing against Cy, when she had nothing to do with the event at all. As a moderator, I can tell people when conversation needs to be diverted back to the topic at hand. Cy cleaned up her act on this site, she doesn't need to be blindsided when the topic at hand doesn't even pertain to her.

What IS happening though, is that people are now bitching about the increased moderation and blowing it out of hand, just like they bitched about the lackthereof before. We have people that don't like that they can't run a muck on this site, act like it's their own personal playground to act and treat people on it just how they want. We don't allow that anymore, so they want to run around FaceBook acting like martyrs and post photos and statuses about how they're planning a mass exodus of the website. Things like THAT are what is making this situation seem worse.

When I spoke with Aaron about the removal of his post from Leone's thread, he said that in hindsight the best course of action for him was to probably start a new thread talking about the matter at hand, as opposed to in Leone's event thread. I told him that I was all for that. Regardless of what you guys think about something, you need to have some respect for other promoters and their business. Discuss these situations, but don't muck up a person's means of advertising. As a neutral ground, we will not allow that to happen. I said this on Facebook, but it seemed like people were up in arms when we deleted posts pertaining to Time Travel from the Leone thread, but yet no one spoke a word when we removed Leone event things from the Time Travel thread. Somehow, that was seen as okay.

I have literally talked this situation to death over the past week, but to make a tl;dr story short, we will continue to run things just how we have been. If people want to blow the situations out of proportion, then that is what will happen. As I said to a few other people, if we really wanted to moderate so that our advertisers and we would benefit, then this thread wouldn't even be here and we'd totally remove the messageboard.







 
SheriffKevin
Member
on another note, those bright flyers on the sides of the screen are really distracting and hurt my eyes
 
"I love how exceptionally real you keep it."  - Eric Bliss
Flownominal
Member
Post from SheriffKevinon another note, those bright flyers on the sides of the screen are really distracting and hurt my eyes
Shhhhhhhh!!!! Shut up before they start blinking in neon highlighter colors!
 
The real solution is throwing smaller more music focused genre specific shows that would and could create a culture of music lovers as opposed to a bunch wanna be rave famous drug addicts.
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